I have done a Bike safe course and I would recommend one to anybody getting on a bike for the first time or for someone returning to biking.   The course is run by the police and Fire service. The whole aim of the course is not to teach you new skills but to improve on the ones you have. The course is spread over two days. the morning is a theory session and the afternoon is an assessed ride with an observer who points out where you are going wrong. Rospa and IAM are also good courses but expensive and time consuming. the advantage of rospa and iam is it may lower your insurance premium.   As others have stated before ride to your own ability. if you ride outside your ability or for the conditions of the road then you will have three crashes.   1st crash - Bike hits object 2nd crash - you hit bike / object 3rd crash - your internal organs hitting skeletal system skull.   crash 3 is usually the fatal one. happy riding                                                                                                                                                                                   

Sounds painful pagan!

I've enquired about the bikesafe course but they said they don't run one altho they'd be happy to come out with me for a few hours. Seems a bit pointless with no theory etc etc

  Quote Geoff: As Kwak says, it's human nature to want to be as quick as your mates   Erm Geoff I din't say that, I said my son was impatient, he doesn't ride with his friends.   Rusty: I'm glad you feel more confident riding your bike ~ it's a wonderful feeling going from complete nervous wreck (in my experience lol) to not thinking about the mechanics of it.  Being experienced doesn't mean being a good rider, your mates 'got a double bend wrong'. Some riders who have done advanced training aren't necessarily safer riders, again speaking from experience, as a pillion.   My son is a naturally good rider, technically. He went from hardly any road experience to passing his test first time, both bike and car.  I had 3 yrs all-year-round road experience, without any accidents and still couldn't pass my test. Which one of us is the better rider?   When I had a bike on the road I enquired about a bike safe course and found out I couldn't do it cos you have to have a FULL licence, not a provisional.                                                                                                                                                                               

No, you didn't say that exactly, this is true.  But you know what I meant.                                                                                                                                                                              

  Do I?                                                                                                                                                                                   

I disagree RK. I the police are happy to go for a run with you for a few hours take them up on it. you will still benefit from it. you will probably go for a run for 30 mins pull over discuss what you have done then continue riding. And if it is free then never turn down the chance of free advice from a professional rider. plus you can ask your question about gravel. I can recommend a good book. it is called Roadcraft, the police motorcyclist handbook. you get a copy if you did manage to get on a bike safe course. but it can also be bought from amazon. other riding manuals are available but roadcraft in my opinion is the defacto standard. there is also a version of roadcraft for cars too.

I think any help from a professional is worthwhile, doubled with tips and help, including those little errors, from friends, and knowledge from books - cheers for the info Phil your a minefield of information !                                                                                                                                                                             

As for gravel, I lost a friend through gravel on the road 3 years ago. Matt was a strapping 6ft 4 gentle giant, aged 32, he had travelled to a rally (Solfest) and had just left on his Blackbird, when a few miles down the road, he skidded on gravel  on the bend, and went off the road straight into a large road sign on the opposite side of the road, and died on impact.  He wasn't riding fast, just happily leaving the rally for the long ride home from Cumbria. He had been riding from being a teen so had years of experience, but unfortunately  his experience wasnt enough that day.  RIP bud xxxxx

RK I'm a bit puzzled that your local police seem to be a bit thrown by your question over a Bikesafe run. I'd certainly take up the chance of picking the brains of a friendly bike bobby as they're some of the best-trained road riders around, but Durham plioce do subscribe to Bikesdafe, according to their website. Having said that. it's branded as Bikewise, but if I was up in your part of the country I'd certainly be at some of their events. (www) durham.police.uk/bikewise/                                                                                                                                                                             

Yeah, bikesafe is slightly different in that it's a national scheme taken up by a number of forces whereas bikewise is specific to Durham.   However, I am sure, as Wills has suggested that it's pretty much the same thing.   Regarding the gravel question, I'd refer to Keith Code who suggests keeping the throttle "cracked" as in open slightly to ensure the bike remains balanced and stable.  In one of his books he explains that going through anything that is slippy or gravelly it is always better to go through with the bike stable than otherwise.  Neither is an ideal situation, but the last thing you want to do (despite every nerve in your body telling you to slow down) is to upset the bike.                                                                                                                                                                             

Not to dwell on the loss of another person but Nutkin's tale is an example of the third crash. this is why if you do have an off it is vitally important to get away from the bike and slide NOT roll for as long as you can. the more you slide the more engergy you disipate and so when you stop the ammount of kenetic energy your internal organs have if greatly reduced. This greatly reduces the level of your injuries. Very few people die of a broken bone unless it causes a bleed of some description.

Poor Matt didnt have any choice, from what I know he was still on the bike on impact.  The emergency services were there within minutes, but he never regained conciousness.  However, his death was not in vain, two people benefited from his organs donated

That gives the title of this thread a completely new meaning.   Thank you Matt for making a difference to peoples lives - both in your life and death.                                                                                                                                                                             

That's a tragic story Nuts, sorry for your loss.                                                                                                                                                                              

An awful tale Nuts.  Speaking as someone else who has lost friends, I am very, very sorry. Hugs.                                                                                                                                                                             

I wanted to bring it to everyones attention because of the topic, basically I believe we need to live our life day by day, and live each day as if its the last one we will have - if you want to do something or say something, do it today......  I too carry an organ donation card, have done since last summers A&E visit because if I can help someone then I will do x

  This is such a good thread I feel it needs refreshing. It may help other new riders, and those who haven't ridden in many years who are returning to biking.    Other experienced riders may like to add their advice and tips for staying alive on the roads, and how to avoid coming a cropper.                                                                                                                                                                             

hmmm just lookin at this thread for the first time. plenty of good advice....bikesafe/bikewise yes absolutely - following a bike cop is an eye opener! the gravel question......do yourself a favour in bends, ignore the state of the road...its too late to worry once ur tipped in...look where you are going...and that means the exit of the bend...your bike WILL go where u r lookin... where cars are concerned assume nothing. never let other riders pressure you out of ur comfort zone. if you want to find your comfort zone limit do a trackday and make use of the instuctor...they will teach you plenty about lines and riding smoothly that you can apply to the road...without the hassle of junctions and cars! anything else just ask...sure everyone who rides a bike will help you no matter how obvious the question.                                                                                                                                                                               

If you want to get used to riding a bike , forget about 'A' roads , they're too fast. Going round a 140mph bend at less than 140mph , will teach you nothing.
A circuit of narrow , twisty , rough and dirty 'B' roads is much more useful . The sort of roads that sixty mph would be considered suicidal.
Just keep going round and round for a few weeks. Trying to get smoother and quicker.
You don't need to exceed the speed limit , even on the straights,
Once you get comfortable and confident, add a few faster stretches of roads.
Loads of fun
Dusty x

. Forgive me for pointing out the obvious but ...on a righthander , the 'apex' of the bend , is where your head goes . Not your tyres.
Dusty x