I'm getting a lot of emails about a change I made yesterday so I'm starting a new topic to explain.

For 2 years the “Upgrade” page has stated that standard membership allows 5 free messages to be sent.  Any more and you have to have a full account.

However, we never enforced this.  Standard members could reply unlimited to full members.

Now we see revenue dropping massively because thousands of people write in their profile “please PM me first as I’m only a standard member”.

If these same people contributed the small price of the website rather than get around it we could halve the cost of membership for everyone.  Instead we had to put the price UP this month for the first time in nearly 5 years because of these people.

Last week 36% of messages were sent by standard members with more than 5 messages already.  We have many, many profiles which state “only standard, please PM me first” or something along them lines which the moderators are working through to tidy up right now.

We have simply started to enforce the existing “rules” which we didn’t previously.
So nothing has changed for the membership types, it’s just we’ve actually added a check into the system now to enforce it.  If the 36% of people who avoided paying every week contributed, the price wouldn't have needed to rise last week by the same %.

Hope you all understand and I hope you agree with my decision.

Any questions - feel free to post them here.  I know not all of you are going to be happy, but hey I'm used to that now with BikerMatch.                                                                                                                                                                             

That's bikers for ya Matt...                                                                                                                                                                             

  The membership cost aint much is it, especially as we have a chat room and loads of forums to post in, and interact in, plus volunteer staff to help us out when we need it. I reckon it's good value for the money. Not to mention, the members themselves, I've been to loads of events and met loads of members and they are all friendly and welcoming.   If you know of another biker site as friendly, with so much to offer and for less money I bet Matt would love to know about it. (Don't hold your breath tho)                                                                                                                                                                               

I've visited the site a few times today, and, found quite a large number of members with 'can't respond - message me and I'll reply - can't respond to nods etc etc...some cleverly worded to escape Mods doing a quick check etc....I think it's wrong that for folk who DO pay and support this site, to find so many 'cheapskates' who are using the site, basically, for free...
Perhaps they do so, because a number of them are on a certain other motorcycle dating site which charges a lot more than this one does (no, I'm not a member of it either! ) so they probably figure 'I'm not paying twice, when I can get BM for free..? I think BM represnts good value, and sets a fair price, shame to see so many abusing that.....

Thank-you for your support, both with subs and also supporting my decision.  I'm monitoring it to see if the change helps the site or not.                                                                                                                                                                             

For all those who are kicking off and complaining at me / mods (all standard members not contributing to the site) there is now a new rule on the rules page making it clear that you cannot request full members to contact you just because you don't want to contribute to the site.

Not many websites where you get to 'try before you buy' for free, esp with all that the site offers members

Personally ... I think the site is well worth the small amount you pay as you cant buy some of the relationships/friendships that have been made by hundreds of members on the site

My opinion as a member not just as a moderator
                                                                                                                                                                             

I don't agree with any of the above. I've been a member here for several years now and quietly continued to pay my membership in order that i can initiate conversation with non paying (standard) members and they have always been able to respond in kind should they desire. You are effectively downgrading the benefits i receive for paying my membership. Exceptionally unhappy with this change - and regardless of what you say about it being an unenforced rule, it's still a change to the way things have been up to yet.   You have gradually chipped away at the benefits supplied to standard members over the last three years (removed the ability to nod for instance) and i understand your desire that everyone pays, so there has been no real way i could complain about the previous changes. This one however, directly affects myself and what i can do with my membership. I am unhappy enough to consider not renewing my membership when it is due again soon.   Should you consider a reply Matt, i'd appreciate it being in this thread rather than in the form of a PM as previously done.   Cheerz, Mark                                                                                                                                                                             

Mark - I always reply :-D   That's one of the benefits you pay for, someone who actually replies to you and dedicates their time to making the site work.

Standard members can contact you if they have sent less than 5 messages.  There are some standard members who have never contributed to the site yet have conversations with hundreds of members and sent thousands of messages.  The same people post hundreds of photos and cause 100,000's hits on the server... costing the site money every day.

Because of these people, YOUR membership costs have had to increase to pay for their usage of the site.  The majority of full members would rather have their costs lowered and have more people pay (in the long run making the site more active too).  The site's running costs are growing at a rapid rate with Facebook and Google charging us ridiculously more for advertising every month.  If more people pay (which they are doing since this change) we can put out more advertising, drive more people to the site giving you more new members to contact.

The running costs of the site last year was nearly 40,000 pounds!!!  Around 90% going to advertising in the magazines, sponsoring MCN, Facebook, Google etc to keep a steady flow of new members coming to the site - the same new members that you want to contact. With only a handful of people contributing and 10x more people putting things like "please contact me first as I'm only a standard member" on their profile, maybe you can now understand why this change had to be implemented.

I'm considering increasing the 5 message limit though... maybe to 20 or 50 messages.  This should be enough for people to try the site and also enough for you as full members to get enough responses                                                                                                                                                                              

Thanks for the reply Matt. I concede your point about non paying members causing hits on the server which cost the site money & admit i hadn't thought of that. Through your response, i realise that side of things needs keeping a greater control on - which you have been doing steadily, as i referred to in my earlier posting.   Although this may seem like a 'about face', i now have to ask why you haven't limited standard members to a single picture if that is costing the site to the extent you mention?   I don't have a problem with the full membership fees having been raised for the first time in several years, but i'm afraid i'm still less than happy with paying more and receiving less. In attempting (and apparently acheiving) generation of more income, you are hitting those of us who are already doing as you wish by reducing what we are getting & it's no good telling us that others are at fault for that - it makes no difference.   Having said all of that, i think your idea of raising the limit of messages a standard member can send would be a good step in the right direction as it would give them a chance to try the site for real before spending their money on full membership. They could (and do) use up the 5 messages on a single contact which turns out badly & that is their only experience of the site on which to base their decision of whether to join or not.   Also, a friend of mine received a message from an admin saying part of her profile had been removed for the reasons given in this thread & the admin proudly proclaimed that they had received no complaints about this procedure as yet - but when she tried to reply, she found she didn't have the ability as a standard member! No wonder there'd been no complaints! Lol!   My membership should run out in a couple of days, but as usual i've received my notice early and will have to have a think about renewal.                                                                                                                                                                             

Hmmm - Mark - standard members are supposed to be able to PM Mods without it eating into their 5 messages - I'll have a word with Matt to check this out                                                                                                                                                                              

  Ditto Holmfirthgirl's comment, except use the 'contact' button on the homepage, not a PM, to contact Matt and/or other members of staff.                                                                                                                                                                               

Thanks for the replies girls, but do you see how even the seemingly simple things become complicated? Is it a PM or some other method of contact? Surely if a response is possible, it should be initiated by a reply/PM button on the message itself? Searching for anything other than that immediately says that a response is not really desireable - and indeed, that may be the case as it would mean servicing a non-paying member! I seem to recall there was a similar issue over the profile picture vote.

Mark, it's not so much the images they upload but rather the hits they generate.  A standard member will sit for hours browsing profiles, running searches, reading the forums etc.  Particularly the searches cause a big hit.  Each standard member draining an extra % of resources.  Then full members complain that the server was "running slow at the weekend" for example while FreebieJohn was skimming all around the site.  The number of pics you put on isn't such a problem to be honest, storage space is cheap - it's the processing power we take a hit with.  However, full members can indeed upload more photos and maybe it's worth restricting standard members more even if just to give more "Benefits" to a full account ???

Anyone can use the contact page to contact myself or staff. Anyone can PM staff even if they have 5,000 sent PMs... you can always reply to staff.  Gotta use Reply button though to answer a question from staff as hitting New Message wont work.  To start a new chat with staff - press the Contact Us button.  It's at the bottom of every page so there's no excuse saying someone can't contact us/me for help.

I don't think the system is so complex.  Ok let's work at making it simpler if necessary, but I think we're making it more complicated than it really is.  Anyone can open their eyes on any website and find the contact button (good luck with Ebay, Facebook etc though)

Ok when I get home from work tonight I will implement these changes...

1) Standard members can upload max 5 photos, not 200
2) PMs sent to staff wont be included in the free messages for standard members
3) Free PMs will increase from 5 to 20.  Should be enough yea?

Any other suggestions?

                                                                                                                                                                             

All changes made.  I've set it to 25 max messages not including messages to staff accounts.

Photos limited to 5 also                                                                                                                                                                             

  Thanks Matt                                                                                                                                                                              

Nice one Boss Man :)                                                                                                                                                                              

no thay cant if thay have been a memder of bm and has sent mesages as a mender  u cant send eny at all                                                                                                                                                                               

Sorry there's no record of whether you sent a PM previously as a full member, standard member or full member using a free upgrade.   The only data available for me to use is how many PMs have been sent in the past... so that will include ones sent as a full member, indeed

Hi Matt,

Just an observation, but it seems a little disingenuous to be moaning at standard non-paying members, when on every page you boldly proclaim: "All British motorcyclists are welcome to join our large and exciting community free of charge in search of ride-outs, motorcycling events & rallies, biker dating & relationships, motorcycle help, motorcycle forums, biking news, racing news, motorcycle classifieds or just to get to know other UK bikers.  Create your profile and upload your photos now completely free."

The emphasis in this blurb is twice on the "free" - maybe you need to rethink how you pitch the site. I am more than happy to have paid a subscription for a few months, as I think there is a lot of good content on the site and want the option of PMing people and generally getting involved (hopefully a bit more this time round!). 

The Facebook page also extols "free, free" all over the place - so to bash someone as 'FreebieJohn' because they are using the service you have provided to the extent they are allowed is unfair. One of the things I like about this site is a refreshing degree of honesty amongst members - I like the fact that profiles need to have face pics and people seem genuine. Yep - I know in this marketing lark you have to draw people in but don't offer something then bash them in a forum because they take you up on your offer!

I think the idea of limiting the number of PMs overall and making it crystal clear when you sign up as a 'freebie' that there is this limitation is good - but also why not market the fact that the paid-for membership is still very good value - use some of your testimonials rather than sinking to the level of every other dating / connections / friends site and touting 'Free'.

Anyhow - observation over! Thanks for a good site and for the effort you clearly put in.